Multi-Species Group

[Etenia]

I'd like to call out to those who aren't in a group and would like to be in one. This kind of group would have multiple species in it. There would also be a need for at least active 5 members needed to give it an official @group on the game.

A name for the group should be discussed. Plus the goals, theme, and structure of the group. One potential idea is a 'round-table committee', of sorts, but other ideas are welcome.

Will there be a counsel to govern the group? How many in the counsel? Is there a desire to have IC leadership to be separate from the OOC leadership?

I have had this idea for a while now to help those who want to be part of a multi-species group and have talked to one other player about it as well as consulted with Curiosity.

I'd like to help something form. I don't mind helping out with creating plots for this group and having an alt part of it in some form to bring information into this group ICly. Likely, I'd play some sort of bird of prey, perhaps a Northern Harrier.

I'd don't know how much as been discussed ICly in this regard and I can help out there as well. But I'd like to know how much interest there is in this sort of group so I can begin helping.

Please contact me either on the forum or the game with any questions. Thanks!

[braxton]

A good idea. In fact, might I point out if you weren't already aware that there's been an unofficial group like that at the merging tributary and nearby areas for a few OOC years you might be able to use as the base membership for that group. It's been known to have a wide variety of critters: Rabbits, foxes, coyotes, cougars, elk, deer, and even an alligator. ICly it's Rye's family territory, so you might want to get in touch with that player if you want to use this area.

I'm not sure as to the name of the group, but it was already Braxton who more or less established what he believed the group was all about, which is basically cooperative survival and the philosophy of "heart." Which means that he believed in the idea of generosity and caring for those in need, never turning away those who needed assistance who wouldn't threaten the group.

There's not been a formal structure of the group, though most critters tended to respect Braxton and Rye's opinions, and the territory is officially Ryes, and generally the rule is not to harm anyone considered a member or a friend of the group.

But since this was an informal group, there's not been any real structure to the group, no "leadership" or somesuch. Though it wouldn't be a stretch for this group to ultimately organize itself ICly if needed. Though I do believe a formal @group doesn't even necessarily have to form a group, if not, one could simply OOCly select @group leaders to administrate while ICly it remains somewhat loose and informal.

That's my input. If you have any questions, I can try to answer them.

[Etenia]

Well I'm looking more for a 'current' thought instead of what was trying to be done in the past. If the majority want to remain without an official @group, then there will be no more asking. If there is a current desire for something more official, then a location that isn't any character's territory is likely best. Plus an updated version of the group goal. I'm really asking for what players want currently and not the ideals or propositions done in the past. This should be something /new/ and not something that is being upgraded. I'd like it to include any characters who are not in a group, not just the ones that are forming an unofficial grouping in an area. Perhaps consider it more an alliance of sorts that has a council that helps govern the alliance to work together.

A more neutral territory would be at the Two-River Fork. Plus it is well-known.

I'm interested in working with whatever the players want. If they do not want to become an official group, I just need to know this. If they do, then I'm all keen on helping with that as well.

At first, I didn't realize that there was any grouping of multi-species at all. However, I was given the go ahead to make it an official group listing so it can attract others into it and also work with other groups if needed, like for the muckwide TPs.

As for a group goal or philosophies, I can't say anything on that. The point I'm trying to make is for me to hear what the group over where Rye is, the large group, wants to do with that unofficial group.

I made a suggestion of a neutral territory because not all non-grouped animals will see it as a welcoming thing to go into another species territory and also to have a sort of council so there is no favoritism if there is one leader, all or a few species can be represented in the council. The group's goal could go from being a support to all the species in the group if there is a disaster, to keeping all group species informed on the major news going on. The group can become a strong network of allies with a cause or crusade or a weak alliance where they council comes together once in awhile.

Either way I'm good with where the players want to take this.

[Pavane]

What Felix mentions isn't really past. Yes, it has history, but it is currently one of the areas with the largest collection of non-@grouped characters on grid.

If you're not interested in working with it, that's fine, but in that case, I'm curious to hear more about your vision for a group. What would bring these characters together? (Other than the OOC motivation of being in an @group.) What philosophies would they share? How would they handle the fundamental tension of predators and prey, or would this be a prey only group?

I understand that you're looking for interested characters, but it's hard (for me, at least) to gauge my interest with no idea at all of what sort of group it would be.

[kuruk]

One problem I see with having an 'unofficial' group like the current one is that some players aren't even aware that it exists. Yes, they could (eventually) find out about it through RP, but new players might be more inclined to app a more diverse range of species if they knew there was a multi-species group of some sort.

[Pavane]

Aug 13, 2011 6:57:40 GMT -5 @kuruk said:

One problem I see with having an 'unofficial' group like the current one is that some players aren't even aware that it exists.

Definitely a good point. I do think that group should certainly be polled for players/characters interested in joining or otherwise affiliating with this potential new group.

It's a little strange to think of claimed/unclaimed territory, because of how species overlap with each other in real life. A coyote's territory might also be a wolf's territory and a bear's territory and the territory of a herd of deer. But I understand the idea of giving each group on-muck a bit of space to host their own scenes.

One useful model from real life that comes to mind is something you get in a number of species - foxes, coyotes, badgers, otters, and more - where a group will den together while not hunting together. An expansion of this sort of idea might hold promise.

So, one problem that needs to be resolved with a multispecies group is the whole predator/prey problem. It seems to me there are two things that need to happen:

1) Predators in the group don't eat prey in the group. For this to work, there's likely going to need to be some form of marking of group members. Perhaps a drawn symbol, or the scent from a particular herb.

2) There is a safe meeting space. No predators in the group hunt there, and they defend it from other predators. That way, new members can think about joining the group without being threatened.

That's just my ideas, though. What do others think?

(Also, I keep thinking about the Animal Fables. It doesn't quite fit, because we don't have the same situation, but some of the fragments of plot there were rather neat.)

[Etenia]

I propose:

1) 'Two-Rivers Fork' for a safe meeting place.

2) Rules would constitute as follows:
a) Predators do not hunt prey that are marked as part of the group.
b) All species part of the group are considered allies and if one ally is being attacked the group will abide by helping that ally.
c) If an area of where an ally lives is being encroached upon, it is up to the group to find a solution.
d) If a food source suddenly disappears, the group is to help balance the ecosystem in some way.
e) Any other threats to an ally or the group at all, must be discussed immediately.

A committee or council should govern the group with at least 3 and at most 7 being council/committee members. The number must remain an odd number to break any ties in voting an issue.

In the case of 3 council members, all votes must be unanimous. At 5 council members, at least 3 must be for or against the issue voted. For 7, at least 5 must be for or against the issue voted.

Immediate issues that do not need council votes are: Lack of food, lack of living area, physical and mental danger to anyone of the group.

Issues that would likely need council votes: exiling a member/species, adding a member/species to the group, punishing a member/species of the group, handling problems with outside group members/species, etc...

The council/committee itself is to help maintain a balance between all the species participating in the group as well as maintaining a balanced ecosystem of the area where all species lie.

This balance obviously, includes food, health, and territory. This also means providing communication between all species of the group. Likely each species would want to have their own messenger and/or diplomat to keep the whole group apprised on their own species situation.

As for the meeting place, it can be also a place where many of the members live but it is still considered neutral and governed by council rules at all time so that no species can claim it to be their area.

The group should have a meeting at least once an RL month, either live on the game or on the Forum-RP board if the majority of the group members and council can't meet at the same time. Winter holiday months will likely mean forgoing of a group meeting though.

As for plots, an OOC vote of what the group members will want to participate in that way everyone has something fun for them in these plots.

[Azoto]

I'd like to make a few suggestions you could use for this:

For ranks, set aside certain 'jobs' as ranks among the group. Known healers or herbalists (I.E. those with animalistic medical knowledge) could be one of the ranks. Other ranks as follows:

*Hunters - For the carnivores, those who would hunt for food for others in lean times or those of energy.
*Gatherers - For the Herbivores and those who hibernate, those who will gather food for those who need to put on weight, or those who come up lame.
*Messengers - those who will go from location to location to pass on messages among the group; for example if foxes a&b live at the stream, and Coyotes C&D are by the fork, the messengers can send a message between the two to come greet; or can round up the group as a whole to gather for meetings. (I would suggest birds for this, maybe even owls. *bricked by Hogwarts fans*.)
*Caretakers - An appointed few who would gather and watch over the young of those in the group who need a break to hunt or get away. A sort of 'communal babysitter' or two.
*Guardians - those selected of the larger mammals and creatures to guard the territory selected by the group. Also to be the lead of any battle that may arise against attacks on members.
*Ambassadors - Those dedicated delegates of the group who are assigned to the task of seeking out others that may wish to join, as well as traveling to other groups (Such as Wolf packs, Horse Herds, Cougar Clans, etc.) to bring discussion and news to them.

These are, of course, just suggestions. n.n;

[braxton]

I'm liking what I am reading so far, though a few questions come up in my mind.

1. How would members of the 3/5/7 member council be selected?
2. Would they be representing a particular species?
3. Would mere friends of the group, but not members, be protected?
4. Would this group see fit to help out other groups in a crisis?

[Greer]

Hi everyone,

I wanted to throw my two cents in on how I think this group could be structured and some of the purpose behind the group.
I like what Azoto said. I think there could be room for multiple jobs within the group that could lead to some good rp. I think the group would be best if we would offer everyone a chance to do something that they would enjoy…perhaps even something that they haven’t been able to do before due to that particular plot point not fitting into a previous group.

I think the purpose of the council would be a couple of things. They could decide ICly the policies of the group. Particularly I think the council can act as a delegation to the other groups on the muck. I hope if we form this group we can still interact with other groups as well as ourselves. I’ve noticed on mucks sometimes that groups get a bit insular and that is when they get boring and sort of die away. I think the whole notion of having a multispecies group is very dynamic and can protect against this somewhat.

Ok. Here goes my proposal. It takes into account a bit of what everyone has suggested:

1. I propose we have a council of 3/5/7 ect that can be democratically elected. This can either be done oocly or icly. I have no personal preference. We could perhaps hold an election every spring muck time to decide who we would want. They could put forth their ideas either ICly or OOCly here on the board and all members of the group could get a vote. We could even have different OOC leadership from ICly if we wanted. In any event I think the group should always be lead by more than one person either oocly or icly. That way it doesn’t get ‘owned’ by any one person or small group of people. I don’t think the leadership would have to be any particular species or represent different species since they would represent all members of the group by being democratically elected.

2. Secondly I think we need to start thinking of a plot that could bring different group members together. Something akin to a pilot episode of a TV show. I think the best way to do this would be to fit in with an existing plot. My thinking is that we could easily use the muck wide plot as a reason for some unaffiliated animals to pull together. There are various TP’s going on such as cubs being stolen, and plague and such that there is easily enough reason for a group to icly form for the purpose of mutual defense and protection. We could easily set up RP sessions for people with concerns such as these or others that would lead to the formation of the group.

I believe all that we need right now is to know who is interested and perhaps what sort of role they would like to have. From there we can begin deciding together on RP story specifics as well as group leadership. I believe that we can all have a hand in leading this group. I look forward to hearing from people that are interested. As for myself Blackberry is most definitely in.

[Deleted]

I don't mean to sound like the pragmatist, but this is a big idea. It seems like something like this would be pretty MUCK wide.

It makes me wonder how those who like to hunt other characters would view it as I can imagine this would be pretty popular with a lot of people as well as new members. They might just slide into a minority, and fear that they'll lose RP opportunities if everyone expects a mutual respect between characters.

Imagine a cougar goes to hunt and accidentally attacks a member of this group. Next thing that cougar knows he/she has an entire wolf pack hunting him/her down. That would be interesting, but not everyone would find it a nice event to be put through.

I like that this would give members of the group more confidence in roaming around on their own (I do enjoy exploring different areas), but it seems like something that would cause a lot of conflict with other groups who want nothing to do with it.

Basically, I think more input is needed before this is official. That's just my opinion though. I'm new and all, what do I know?

[Greer]

I don't see any reason why we couldn't make use of the present plot with the dogs to make this group a reality. I like many of the things that have been posted thus far. It stands to reason that members of other species would be just as threatened by this invasion from the outside and would want to stand with the wolves to remove them. It would perhaps put into place the roots of the multi-species group. Perhaps members of other species who had come together to fight the dogs would see some value in maintaining communication with each other after the crisis is over.

I think we could set up the group in a manner similar to what has been suggested. I like the idea of a council that could be made up of leaders of other sub groups. They could perhaps meet once a month or every couple months to talk and plan. The rules could evolve naturally and most importantly RP would happen. Perhaps the multi species group in time could contribute to a muck wide plot of their own? Who knows. The sky is the limit.

[Kvatch]

Heya peeps,

I haven't really unloaded my opinion on this topic, because as it stands, I'm not particularly interested. Mind you, I do like the idea of the multi-species group, as well as see the benefits in regards to amplifying player character and sub-group interaction. However, the only part that turns me off personally -as anyone who knows my role-play habits could guess- is the whole 'kumbaya' feel to it; that everyone gets along and doesn't eat anyone and so on and so forth. I enjoy relaxing, Happy Days role-play as much as the next person, but after awhile, it starts to get stale without /some kind/ of adversity.

This said, I'm not opposing the idea. I'm all for it. I'm just saying', if it stays the course, I don't see myself getting involved to deeply.

However, with the prospect of what would interest ME (and maybe others), what comes to my mind is a group scenario sort of how the clans in the Warrior Cat series were set up. For those who haven't ever read them, essentially between clan meetings, each clan/group pretty much held it's own territory/area and went about their customs and social habits. Then every month or so a meeting would be held at a location where physical violence was prohibited and here elected representatives (or group leaders/speakers) would all gather together and share news of births, joined mates, new leaderships, first kills, ect ect.

And of course, because a book would be boring without adversity, issues would arise between clan/groups, usually consisting of encroachment of territory/food supply or unjust attacks. Sometimes animosity would arise between two groups and at the next meeting, the clan leader/group representative would announce their intent for war or request for punishment of the offending group/clan for any grievances. Various scenarios, essentially. Of course, if nothing could be agreed upon and two groups declared 'war', the other groups would have to decide who to back or how to stop it. (Think Roman republic kind of style)

Anyhow, I think something set up in this fashion would make the group more feasible, rather than a group of racoons, deer, coyotes, foxes, and ect, all trying to help each other out on a daily basis, regardless of territory or social habits. This way, it avoids force-locking a player or sub-group down to playing only 'friendly' types.

But yeah....now I'm rambling...I think.

[Chibiabos]

Apologies for jumping in so late. I'm interested. It sounds like, unfortunately, the Dorado horse herd may get delisted, its just been way inactive, and I'm to blame for that as much as anyone else, and may get rolled into the mixed species group. That would make 3 characters of mine that might be recruitable into it:

Lilac my vixen ... I've had her a long time but have not been active with her, so much of her life has been missing. She's probably just been hanging around.
Foxglove my doe who was part of the de-listed deer herd ... she's a mom, but her fawn is an adult now, also been very inactive with her
And now Dandelion, my Dorado mare ... she too has been inactive, but not as inactive as those other two.

[Greer]

Good morning everyone!

The multi-species group is officially a go. RP surrounding this group will be begining on the muck shortly. Right now we are looking for folks who would like to be a part of it. If you see me online and want to get some group rp in please feel free to page me.

Thanks!